soldiers

[emma5721]

"think its very unfair how the soldiers are been treat over the STUPID PHOTOS"




HOW SHOULD they be treated then?

the photos showed men being tortured and treated like animals removing human dignity

AND THE SOLDIERS were smiling and joking whilst they were at it - that ok is it?

AND they were the stupid ones sending the film into the developing shop down the road
good job they did tho.........................rolly eyes

hope they get chucked out the army they dont deserve to wear the uniform jmo.....................

[mrscheeks]

Was going to let rip here like you have never seen .... well, minus the swearing rofl.

But everyone else has said it so well.

What kind of plonker thinks that these were just "stupid photos"? Hmmmmm someone perhaps who would do such atrocities him/herself maybe?

What kind of plonker says these soldiers are being treated unfairly? Words fail me to the utter ignorance of that poster!!!!

And we were RIGHT to go into Iraq, we were RIGHT to get rid of Husseins regime once and for all, and we were RIGHT to be helping millions of people finally have the right to say who they want to run it. how they want it to be run and what religion they wish to practise.

I notice there is no compassion for the thousands of Iraqi's killed because they served in the Iraqi Army or the Iraqi Police? Killed NOT by us, but by fanatics desperate to keep Husseins dictatorship and tyranny alive ... one of raping, torturing, maiming and killing anyone who spoke out against him.

Best I say nothing else ....... touchy subject to say the least.

Vik xxx

[dragonmist]

A few points. This has always gone on, and Officers have turned a blind eye, or even encouraged it to get "results", which is why so many members of the IRA, imprisoned in NI, got thousands of pounds compensation. You won't see any of the Officers in Court though.
Sadaam Hussein did not adhere to the Geneva Convention when dealing with captured American and British soldiers. They were beaten and humiliated and shown on TV. A couple of service women were raped. If the Iraquis do not follow the rulings of the Geneva Convention, it could arguably be said that the opposing armies should not be bound by it either. The Convention was supposed to be observed by both sides after all.
As I live near a town that has 2 barracks, I can tell you this much. The photos were very sanitised compared to some sent by Mobile Phone.
The Officers would have preferred that photographs were not taken, so no evidence. After seeing what happened to our soldiers who were ambushed by "civilians" I am not in the least surprised at the treatment they are receiving. War is a dirty business. Always has been, always will be.
I agree with Fender. We shouldn't be there.... but then our opinion was never asked.

[swopmebob]

Well said by all.I shall penn no comment on the situation as would be classed as sour grapes by the author.Documented extremely well,be better if arms were used for hugging not killing.

[emma5721]

A few points. This has always gone on, and Officers have turned a blind eye, or even encouraged it to get "results", which is why so many members of the IRA, imprisoned in NI, got thousands of pounds compensation. You won't see any of the Officers in Court though.
Sadaam Hussein did not adhere to the Geneva Convention when dealing with captured American and British soldiers. They were beaten and humiliated and shown on TV. A couple of service women were raped. If the Iraquis do not follow the rulings of the Geneva Convention, it could arguably be said that the opposing armies should not be bound by it either. The Convention was supposed to be observed by both sides after all.
As I live near a town that has 2 barracks, I can tell you this much. The photos were very sanitised compared to some sent by Mobile Phone.
The Officers would have preferred that photographs were not taken, so no evidence. After seeing what happened to our soldiers who were ambushed by "civilians" I am not in the least surprised at the treatment they are receiving. War is a dirty business. Always has been, always will be.
I agree with Fender. We shouldn't be there.... but then our opinion was never asked.

erm are you saying just cos they did it its alright for us to do it????
i thought thats half the reason the war was purportedly started - to rid the world of such things

i think it takes a certain sort of person to do this sort of thing .........nothing to do with war being dirty business.........imo to do with what sort of "soldier " one is

jmo

[dragonmist]

No Emms. Not saying it's right or wrong. Just that it has always gone on. The only difference is now we have laptop computers, satellite linked TV, camera phones, digital cameras that don't need films, so now we see the evidence. Before these technological advances we saw nothing of the dirty side of war. It was Army business, and civilians were few in a war zone. There were news reporters, but they were only allowed to send heavily censored text, and no pictures because of National Security. Now if there's a war every Tom, Dick or Kate Adie puts on a flak jacket and heads out for a look see.
The Army used to do what it had to do to get results. Now we have the human rights business. Some of these people are guilty of dreadful atrocities, and some might feel they had strayed from what makes people human. Just playing Devil's Advocate, because I can genuinely see and appreciate both points of view. It is never all black and white, there are varying shades of grey in between. There will be a few "Show trials" and the rest will be covered up and swept under the carpet. Nothing will change, because it never will. The bill for compensation will of course be enormous.

[emma5721]

yes i know youre right

just amazes me that human beings can act like this
wherever they come from
shakes head

[blufairy]

Kev, are you for real hun.

Those photos where shocking ans sickening and Im guessing just the tip of a very big iceberg.

Degrading prisoners and torturing them in a SEXUAL manner is beyond any reasonable atempt at MAKING them talk etc ... or Working them , as has been suggested.



On Question Time i noted that aparently some Iraq (ies ) have been heard to have said that those photos are nothing compared to what the iraq police/soldiers have done.

2 wrongs dont make a right and deff not at this scale.

They are prob nothing to what was NOT photographed either.

I believe the problem lies at the TOP .

A bad soldier will take advantage of unreasonable and downright evil commands given to them by those in charge.

A good soldier will feel scared to speak out against them.

THAT IS THE PROBLEM. There needs to be workable measures in place where by a soldier who KNOWS whats going on is way beyond anything they should be expected to be doing , should be able to REPORT these things and be protected whilst investigations take place to rid the British Army of this percentage of scum.

Current measures are by no means acceptable and secrecy in the armed forces is a ticket for those at the top to continue to order and or turn a blind eye at this kind of treatment of prisoners.

I can not believe for one moment this is as rare as they are trying to have us think. We just dont normaly hear about it.

Ignorance is bliss.

But when , as in on this ocassion , we do find out about what is going on .............. to then try to make any attempt at condoning or ignoring or trying to play down those photos is in my view dispicable.

[dragonmist]

Emms, I just wonder what sort of people want to join the army anyway. When I was a teenager, all the young boys went into National Service unless they were medically unfit. This was stopped, and for a while young men joined to learn a trade. This was a good idea, but a friend of mine, who was brilliant with electronics, joined the RAF as he wanted to work on Radar and stuff. The wag who filled in his recommendation sent him on training to be... a male nurse. He wasted time till his father bought him out, and then he went and trained at Decca Radar.
Nowadays the recruits we see at Windsor are all Gung Ho and want to go and shoot people. Since the Iraq business applications to join the army have rocketed.

[rightcharlie]

The problem is you cant train young men to become killers and then expect them to behave like friendly coppers or social workers.

Yes, what they did was wrong, but equally at fault is the management process.

Adequate provision was clearly not made for the safe detention of POW's.

The soliders, Im afraid to say, are only the visible part of a massive iceburg...